How Will Bruins Line Combos Play Out? | Pucks With Haggs

How Will Bruins Line Combos Play Out? | Pucks With Haggs

Welcome to the Pucks with Hacks podcast, a proud member of the CLNS Media Network. Make sure to hit subscribe to the Bruins Ringside YouTube channel and turn on notifications for when a new video drops on the channel. The show is also brought to you by Prize Pickics, the largest daily fantasy sports platform in North America. Download the Prize Pix app today and use the code CLNS and get $50 instantly when you play five bucks. That’s code CLNS on Prize Pick to get $50 instantly when you play $5. You don’t even need to win to receive the $50 bonus. It is guaranteed. Prize picks run your game. Uh, welcome on in. This is the 216th episode of the Pucks with Hags podcast. I’m your host, Joe Hagerty. You can find my work at joehagerty uh.substack.com. Subscribe and get yourself premium membership. Get all of my Bruins and NHL writing sent straight directly to your inbox. I also write columns for the Boston Sports Journal and do a weekly Q&A with the subscribers there. So, uh, make sure to get a subscription to Boston Sports Journal if you haven’t already. Great stuff over there in all the different sports. With me today, I have doublebarreled action. We’ve got the New England Hockey Journal, Evan Marinowski, and Arlington High hockey coach John Missouri. We’ve we’ve started using you guys as a tag team because you’re so good together doing these podcasts. Welcome into the show, guys. Thanks, Joe. Thanks for having us. We’re just we’re we’re so so much chemistry between us that it just Oh, yeah. something out of the way here early. Yeah, please. I don’t know if you guys know the shirt that I’m wearing here. I don’t. What is that? So, this is a live golf shirt, which is a, you know, I’m a PGA tour guy, but this is this is the best I could do. This is the team range goats, and I’ve got shirt on specially because we got Evan Marinowski with us, and he is the New England Hockey Journal goat. So, I’m wearing this. Marinowski is the goat, and this is my best goat picture that I got. Oh, you know, thank you. I was just about to make a joke about you taking Saudi oil money, but I guess I won’t do that. Hey, if the Saudis offer you the oil money, you take it, Evan. I take it. Oh my. No questions asked. Easy. Oh, that’s an easy decision. But, uh, that’s awesome. Thank you for joining us. And you guys are going to be uh uh hanging out together later on today. Right, John? What’s uh what’s going on? So, uh about eight, nine years ago, we started doing a high school showcase, which is a weekend where you’ve got to be a high school player um to participate in the showcase. So, we try to get, you know, the top 100 high school players in a rink for the weekend. Get some college coaches in there, some junior coaches in there, and let them uh take a look at at the kids. And you know what I mean, like most showcases, it’s, you know, not a lot happens, but we’ve been fortunate like over the last five, six, seven years, at least one kid every year kind of gets some sort of deal, you know, to a college or, you know, gets a good get some good traction with junior. So, it’s it’s been successful for us in that sense. Um, but it’s also a good weekend. We do we do some seminars in the middle of it. This year we’re adding a mental um peak performance piece to it. So, it’s games, practices, and some uh seminars. That’s awesome. And it’s, you know, it’s great when somebody uh like you in the hockey world helps organize something like this because so many of these things when parents are navigating them have no idea if there’s like eyeballs and people really watching them. If something does come of it, if it’s like, you know, a money grab or if it’s like the real deal where you’re looking out for the kids and trying to, you know, get them attention and get them looks and, you know, then just have fun. Most of these kids have played with each other before, played against each other before and all know each other. So, it’s a pretty good time for them. I think that’s that’s a great thing that you’re doing. And uh where where are the games going to be at people? We’re we’re going to be in the old Wuben rank stomping grounds and one young Joe Haggedy for the Daily Time Chronicle. That’s right. Yes. Going to 99 right afterwards. That’s right. That’s right. And if we were like Kazabooki, we’d be going to the cowoon and getting some sus wings afterwards. That was that was phenomenal times. Yeah. Make a mockery of some lobster sauce. H that that is the the 99 at the four corners was the goat of uh postgame O’Brien Rink uh gettogethers for everybody. There’s no question about it. All right. Um thank you guys for for joining us. Uh let’s get into it right away. Um I just wanted I hadn’t had you guys on for a while, so I wanted to get your thoughts, John, first of all about um free agency, what the Bruins did, who they’re bringing in. uh Mikey Isamont, um uh Tanner Jano, they traded for Victor Arvdson. Um you know, they brought in some guys that definitely add some physicality, add a little bluecollar, add some energy and some juice as Don Sweeney called it. Um, I think they’re going to rely a lot on Victor Arverson to be like a top six guy and to put up the kind of offensive numbers he did a few years ago um, prior to uh, getting on with the Oilers, which was a stack team. But, uh, your thoughts just in on what they did and expectations for them and sort of the players that they brought in and what your read is into all that? Yeah, I I I think like the the guys they’ve brought in, there’s nobody transformative, right? Right. you know, but it’s not going to be a fun team to play against, you know, because they’re going to be strong. They’re going to be grindy. Um, you know, and again, like you’re saying about Averson, it’s going to come down to can he return to form, right? Like if he returns to form and Lindholm returns the form and Zachary, like that’s what we’re kind of hoping on. But it seemed like the last time we were on we were talking about this. It seems like to me they’re saving some money and they’re waiting for after this year. They’re trying to open up because a lot of these deals are one-year deals. I was looking a lot of one year deals. A lot of money gonna free up after this year. Um, so I’m guessing they have a longer run plan based on these signings this year. You know, put it hard to play against this year and then hopefully next year make a transformative signing or to bring in Hagens and get going again. Yeah. and and you could see how it could be a two to threeyear plan that they’re looking at that actually could really get them in an upward traje trajectory and get them back to where they want to go. But like the b the bare minimum the bottom line I think for Bruins fans is they want a a team that’s going to be a tough out a team that’s going to be hard to play against. a team that is going to, you know, even if they’re going to lose some nights, they’re going to battle you and they’re not, you know, what we saw last year with that team, especially on the road in some games where they were just breaking and folding. And, you know, once a couple bad things started happening to them, it was just like, you know, they basically look like they were waving the white flag and they ended up giving up seven, eight, nine goals in the game. Like, you can’t repeat that. you know, if that starts to happen uh after you’ve recognized the problems and it happens again, that’s when you really start um getting into problem areas where you’re going to sink low into a you know um a place you don’t want to be in the NHL. And and I think they addressed it in the right way. Evan, I don’t think we had you on for a while either. So, your thoughts just on um the guys that they brought in. I didn’t mention Yokaharu, they brought him back, too, which I thought was a really good move uh on the back end as well. He played great with Zidorov. Um, but all of those guys that they’ve brought in and and sort of what that’s done to your expectations or what you think about this team uh going into this year. It’s funny, Hags, like I was thinking before coming on, I’m like I haven’t talked to Bruins in a long time because I’ve been doing all the prospect interviews for Bruins beat. So like Conor’s been away, so it’s like I haven’t gotten a chance to really uh dive in dive deep on uh this current team coming up. Um you know, I look I think they you’re right, Hags, they one thing I think you can cross off the board is they’re not going to lose games seven to one this year. like that. I think you can you can pencil in. What I what I think you can also pencil in is there gonna be a lot of lowscoring games too and they’re gonna be defensive and they’re going to be hard to play against and that’s the identity that they’re going with. Now, I would make the argument that they signed maybe one too many of those types of guys. But I get the direction. I understand it. Like you were not in free agency ever going to sign guys who made you, you know, a much better offensive team, right? Like all those guys, Besser, Connor, they resigned. like it nothing or excuse me, Connor went to uh what was it? Carolina he went to, right? So again, yeah. So it wasn’t Yeah. Um but so that’s my thing is like I I I think they’re going to be hard to play against. Uh they’re going to be defensive. Um and that’s what their identity is going to be. Sturm has telegraphed that in every interview he’s done. Um and and to me like you know John hit it on the head with like it’s future seasons, right? like getting James Hagens probably next spring at latest next fall and then you know you get into uh are is there anybody uh that they’re going to have in free agency next year? My thing with the free agency argument and I’ve seen this in a lot of places um Freriedman even mentioned this uh on 32 thoughts uh like what are the chances any of those guys are actually going to be available in free agency like I like Jack Eel turn into like this summer again next summer where everybody resigns ahead of time. Yeah. And and look, some some might make it. Like I I don’t There’s a lot of names. There is so many names on there. If two make it, you will. Yeah. I don’t think they possibly all resign. But it it it does make you ask the question, what level are the players that are going to actually be out there as far as being transformative like John mentioned or gamechanging? And Ty Anderson wrote about this. Every team has a ton of cap space. Yeah. Every team’s going to have a lot. you actually don’t have much cap space in comparison to other teams cuz so many teams have so much cap space next off seasonason. So my big thing is like who’s going to be available? Uh and and and you know do you have a shot at them? Do they want to come to you? Like Eel is the one everybody mentions. I I can’t see him leaving Vegas especially now with Marner like that just I think it’s too good of a situation. Um but is a Capri off available? Do you go for a Paneran? is a Mart is Marty Nas. We see him postrock posting with him. Like yeah, is Nas coming here? Like I think that’s that’s very realistic. Nous. So like I get that and it’s just you know I I I think I saw a podcast with you Hags recently. It was like are the Bruins underrated next season. Yes. And to me I think they kind of are. I still look at them as like they’re drafting 12th or 13th. They are not terrible. They’re not in the playoffs. They’re in that middle area. And a lot of people will say, “Oh my god, that’s the worst place to be.” But I don’t think that’s the case. You have Hagens, you have a bunch of first round picks coming up. Um, your prospect pool is kind of reinvigorated and you have money to spend. Um, so to me, you’re not in the worst possible place. I just think this year it’s going to be there going to be some one- nothing losses this year, and people have to be okay with that. Yeah. No, they’re going to lose some two to one games. They’re going to win some two to one games, three to two. It’s going to be, you know, it’s all based on on Swayman bouncing back and their defense being as healthy and as good as people think they’re going to be. If that happens, I think they’ll be in the mix. Maybe they’ll fall short of the wild card because the Atlantic is really good and the East Eastern Conference is really strong. But I think they’ll be at least a entertaining somewhat entertaining team to watch because of how hard they work and of course but because pasta’s on the team and they’ll be competent and they’ll play close games and they’ll win a bunch of them and they’ll be okay and and to your point they’ll be on a trajectory where the next two three years you can see the upward movement you can see the improvement. You can see the plan that’s in place uh to get them better. Now, the cap space thing I think is a legit argument to a degree, but like they’re projecting to have over 20 million in cap space. So, you’re going to be able to get any player that you want if you’re willing to spend the money, you know, and o outspend somebody or attract somebody to you uh with that kind of money, you know, even if other teams have more. It it is getting to a point though with the way the cap is going up where it’s going to turn into the teams with the real money are going to be able to outspend other teams because not everybody’s going to spend to the ceiling like the Rangers and the Leafs and you know some of those teams are going to be able to outspend the smaller market teams that won’t spend all the way to the salary cap ceiling that that I think is going to happen similar to what was in place and what happened before the salary cap went into place and before we lost the whole season to the lockout back in u you know 0405 that’s kind of what what was happening there is just the Leafs and the Rangers and other teams could outspend everybody else. Uh, and it’ll be like that to a degree, but the Bruins still have enough money to land like that transformative player if they want, that veteran guy. Um, when we look at at the roster, John, who who are your centers? Who who are the guys that you think and and how would you put them together? Would you um put Posternneck and Geeky with Lindholm and leave them all together? Would would Middlest be your second line center? Do you think guys like uh Fraser Minton and Matt Potra are ready for, you know, a third line center type situation? How do you see the lines sort of playing out just when you look at the players and what you know know about them going into training camp? Yeah. So, so I think one play and and I’m going to hit the lines quick here for you, but I think one player who’s going to be interesting is Geeky, right? Did he have a breakout year? Is this what he is now? And if he this is great, right? like if he’s going to be a 30 goal scorer for us, that’s going to really, you know, be be a huge difference, right? So, you know, and I think you got to keep Limhone in the Lindholm in the middle there. I like Zacher in the middle because I don’t like him on the wall. I don’t think he’s physical enough to play on the wall. So, I think he’s in between middle stat, right? And I think I at the bottom the bottom I think you’ll see Cari is the third line center and Beecher is the fourth line center. Like that’s I think how it’ll play out. You know, there’s going to be a battle for the bottom six. Yeah. Like there’s going to be a battle like they they’re going to have a couple of decent players in the stands. I think I think the bottom six you I I hate you know like if you I hate to say it but like based on the lines like if you look at our weaknesses the reality is we just don’t have a you know besides posture and potentially geeky you know based on how they performed last year like our bottom six is as strong as most teams bottom six. It’s our top six that we just don’t have one more guy. Yeah. Yeah. And if Arvdson uh steps up and is a 20 goal plus guy and is what he was before he had the back injury in LA before he went and and part of him going to Edmonton. I I chalk up to like he went to a loaded roster where he probably just wasn’t getting a puck as much as he had in some of the other places that he’d been playing. but he is 32 and you know there there could be signs there that you know he’s starting to slow down a little bit and it’s going to be interesting to see what they can get out of him. But I think there’s going to be tons of chances for him to score to have the puck uh to you know to be a guy that that can be an offense provider and it sounds like they’re just going to put him netfront on the power play that top power play unit like right off the bat. So that’s going to be that’s going to be another area where he’s going to be able to you know um eat things up offensively a little bit. Joe, what’s what’s an interesting exercise, right, is and I you obviously I’m I’m coaching high school, not pro, but and I haven’t done this I’ I’ve done it a little bit. I’ve looked at it on the college level. If if you so money ball in hockey is not that hard, right? Okay. You can go ahead and look at the teams that were in the finals last year or the semifinals or had a really good regular season. You can look at their goals for you can look at their goals against average and you just got to say that’s the numbers I’ve got to get to. So then you look at your lineup and you start saying okay where am I how am I going to get to um 360 goals. Yeah. So you start plugging in. Okay 33. Pastor I need you to give me 40. So you start plugging it in and it’s a money ball exercise like okay and then is our defense going to be good enough and you know team-wise and our D and our goalending to keep us at a 2.3 something right? Yep. So you can look at what we’re talking about here and you can project it out I think very simply with with a little very simple money ball. I do it all the time. I know if I get to 80 I’m winning the Middle Sex League and I know if I’m getting a 90 95 I probably have enough firepower to beat the Catholics in the tournament. Yep. you know, and it’s really it’s not the money ball in hockey is not that hard. It’s true, but and you know that I guess the depressing thing if you’re you’re a Bruins fan trying to do that is looking at last year’s stats and trying to extrapolate for this year when they were between 25th and 32nd in every single c category offensively and defensively. And it looks pretty bleak when you look at it from that point, but like we’re adding 2D back, right? We’re at you who like you’re adding your two like losing your number one and number two D is catastrophic. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like I like Zidorf, but I I mean honestly like I think he’s a six in this league who gives toughness. His outlets aren’t great, but he’s a great teammate. Yep. You know what I mean? He can get caught, you know, but I I mean I want him on my team all day long, especially as the um that I am. I’d want him on my team, you know? you know, so so but like you know, but you know, he was playing in in in a one and a two role last year at times. So wasn’t Lori. Like they’re not even close to that level. Like people don’t realize like when they’re watching a pro hockey game that in a very subtle way, it’s not that different from a youth hockey game where the top guys are just way better than the bottom guys. Like it looks like that margin smaller, but there really is a significant difference out there. Yeah. Especially when it comes to skill and offense and creativity and creating offense like there those guys definitely like they they are far out outshine everybody else. That’s why Poster Neck is so amazing to watch because he continually uh does it year after year. Evan, those lines might be a bit blurred for Bruins fans this Yeah. Go to the D. Go to the D. It’s the subtle stuff like Yep. When Makavoy gets the puck in our zone, there’s a good in our zone there’s a good chance something good’s going to happen. Right. It’s significantly better than Zador offi. Yes. Right. I mean, and it’s so subtle that if you don’t really know the game in super detail, you don’t understand like, hey, he put that pass in this area so that wing could get that pass going the other way versus making him just turn a little, took a little time and space away, and we didn’t get out of the zone. You know what I mean? So, so a guy like Makavoy, he makes those subtle, it’s like just such an upgrade having him and Lindol back. Yeah. is going to drop. It definitely will. I Oh, significantly. Like those numbers will improve. There’s no doubt about it. Um, and and you know, there’s X factors here, uh, John, as far as doing, uh, the Moneyball thing that you’re talking about because of guys like Arvdson, because you don’t know how much better the power play is going to be with Steve Spot coming in, a guy that’s renowned to be a pretty good power play coach and and a guy that’s going to, I think, help that unit. Um, where it’s going to turn into much less sort of standing around watching what Postnak’s going to do or trying to, you know, make everything go through him. um even though he’s going to be a significant part of the power play I’m sure still uh Evan your thoughts just on the lines how you how would you put them together um would you keep uh Geeky and and Lindhol and Posternack and when you talk about geeky John I agree with you I do think the only way he’s going to stay at the 30 goal level that he’s at right now is if he plays with Pasta because Pasta does such a good job of setting him up when he gets tons of attention on him with the puck and and Geeki though will score goals I think moving forward just because he’s become so confident in his shooting and he knows he can score when he gets the puck and he’s looking to shoot even before he gets the puck. Yeah. No, hopefully hopefully he’s breaking out. Yeah. Yeah. So that that will hopefully hopefully continue for him. How do you see see things developing here, Ev? Yeah, it’s interesting with Geeky because like he could go in either direction, right? Like last year was a bit of an outlier, but he is 27, so it’s like maybe this is what he is. And I agree like I think he has to be with Pastor to get back to last season. I look at the top six. I actually think the top six isn’t really super debatable. Like unless someone breaks out in camp, I think it’s Geeky Lindholm Posternok and I think it’s Zaka Middlestead Arvdson. Left wing, center, right wing. I think that’s what they go with. Um those are relatively proven guys. Hope Arvdson has more in him. Um and as John alluded to, the big question is the bottom six. Who is down there? And like I was even scribbling out a potential bottom six as John was talking and you have like almost four third or fourth lines like you have you have so many guys who are contending for down there. I mean you have Tanner Jano like right now just scribbled out I had Jano Mitten Potra like you got to figure out what Potra is going to do. Is he going to play wing? Like I don’t know if there’s a spot for him at center. Then you’ve got like Acimont Cari Castillic that’s like a pretty physical forcheing fourth line. But then you’ve got guys like Houston, you have Beecher, you have um Mate Tley, and you have Steves. You have all these guys. It’s like where do they fit now? Templey could and Steves were both productive guys in the AHL and they’re only like 25 26. Maybe they fit in in that middle six. Maybe they push out of camp. Maybe they’re great in the preseason and they force the Bruins hand into into moving in there. Um I don’t know where Beecher fits. I don’t know where Beecher fits. And this was my thing. Like I don’t I get why they are they qualified him because he’s a first round pick. Y but I think if you take the first round pick thing away. I didn’t notice him a lot last year and I don’t know where he fits. you ha you have like he brings speed which is great but that there’s so many guys in that bottom six like Patra’s got there’s got to be a spot for Potra it feels like right like you could you could put him back in Providence but there it feels like you know at some point he’s got to break in and there’s got to at least be a spot for him same with Mitten and it you know it doesn’t have to be this season but you’d like to see especially in a season like this young guys get in the lineup if they earn it if they earn it like Zaka was your second line center. Second line, left wing. Oh, second line, left wing. So, it’s Zaka, Middlestat, Arvdson. Yeah. Okay. And you can look, you could go right down the middle, Lindholm, Zaka, Middlestat, one, two, three, but I think you have too many contenders for that 3C. And the offensive upsides relatively too big with um Zakar Middlestat to put them on the third line. So, yeah, those that’s who I go with. The top six not that um debatable as of now. And look, I hopefully new faces emerge in camp. Potra pushes for a spot. maybe Templey or somehow Tanner Jano returns to 2021 form and he’s you know humming again like I don’t know but to me like the real story is like how do you how do they mix up that bottom six? Yeah. And and and is there enough talent there to create a really effective third line that’s going to give you enough offense I think to legitimize themselves as a third line instead of having basically two fourth lines. I think that’s going to be a huge question and something they’re going to need uh uh given the offense that they’re bringing to the table this year. Um all right, let’s take a break real quick. Uh Prize Pix is the largest daily fantasy sports platform in North America. 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All right, uh let’s get into a couple questions and then we’re going to get into a little youth uh hockey talk at the end. Uh, considering how Casey Middlestat performed, how likely do you think it is that he could be beaten out by Matt Potra for the second center spot, if not with the additions of James Hagens and Fraser Minton being a more natural fit for a third center slot? Potra have a future with the organization. Uh, John, we haven’t gotten your thoughts on Potra. Where do you think he fits in uh with this mix of Bruins? And what do you think of him just having watched him? Um, I definitely see the flashes. He’s small. He’s not. He’d be such a better player if he was a little more explosive with his skating. Um are a little heavy, huh? Yeah. But he’s not. So like you you know, but the the the mind, the creativity, like his competitiveness, he puts himself in tough situations some sometimes where he takes big hits because he’s courageous. Uh I like him as a player. I just wonder what his like ultimate upside is. Yeah. I mean, his dilemma is right, is he’s fighting for a top six spot, right? Like I go back to when I was playing Joe. Like you sometimes you don’t realize it when you’re young. Like I’m sitting running around in the miners and I’m like all bummed out, right? And I’m like I’m better than that guy. I’m better than that guy. I’m better than that guy. And then I’m like wait a second. Like I was trying to beat Adam Oats out. Yeah. Right. You know what I mean? Like that’s that’s whose job I was trying to take. Right. So you know that he’s in that situation, right? Like you know I think I think he needs an injury and then some top six minutes. I don’t think they’ll give him the opportunity to play ahead of Lind Holm, right? I Saka or Middlestat or those guys. But I do I do think if like it’s and this is like hard for people to understand how the game works at times. Like I do think if there’s a top six injury, he gets they should plug him in there. Yep. Right. And I and I think that’s what he’s going to have to do. And I think I I wouldn’t give up on the guy because the intangibles that you just mentioned, Joe, like there aren’t a lot of guys who know how to get to the right spots on the ice and there aren’t a lot of guys with hockey sense. And to me, like that’s separated. So it’s really hard to develop hockey sense. It’s not that hard to get a stride faster these days. Like they re they know how to do that. They know how to improve your skating. Espec Especially with him at his age where he’s like 21 I think now. 20 21. You see guys still gain speed at that age as they gain like their final like level of strength that they’re going to get and you know physical maturity. Yeah. If he was a college player last year and he was playing in Hockey East, how many points would he have had and people would be going goooo gaga over him? It’s true. You know, you know what I mean? Like if you know, we talked about this last time about the evaluation. Like I’d rather a sure thing than a draft pick, you know, because they don’t know. They they don’t know what they’re looking at. Like and I don’t mean that meanly. Like none of us really do except for like those top three or four players. But like look at look at look at the guys who were Max Doy was drafted ahead of you know past like there were he was like the 36 rated rated wing in that draft like so you don’t know right. So, but I think like a kid like that, like again, like if he was in college and we just signed him out of Ohio State, we’d be going, “We got this kid out of Ohio State had more points than Lennon, right?” I call that the Jimmy Vzy effect. Remember how crazy everybody and Jimmy’s a good player? Like, he’s had a great NHL career, but do you remember him getting like flown all over the place and like wind and dyed by all these NHL teams? like and I I remember clear as day still uh because we were talking to uh players at captain’s practice while all that was going on and I remember David Crerachche going what has this guy done to deserve any of that like he was totally honest about it like what the hell is going on where like I’m a I’m a NHL player that’s proven myself and I’m a damn good center and like you don’t have teams flying me around uh trying to woo me to their team and it didn’t really happen that much afterwards it was kind of just everybody got caught up in that fever with that player and and Joe, that is more the rule than the exception. I I just had a player, right? I had a player I had last year. He’s a big freshman defenseman and Oh, I know exactly. Yeah. He had he had good outlets, right? And he’s a special kid and his parents are 6’4 and 61 and his brother’s 66 and you know, I’m trying to tell people like when he was a freshman, he didn’t play a lot for me, but he played and I’m like, this kid could end up in the NHL someday and I can’t get any traction, right? So then this year he plays for us. He played good for us, you know what I mean? Some games he was great, some games he was good, but it’s all there. And no matter who I told how good this kid was going to be and someday he’s going to play in the NHL, like nobody will listen to me. Yeah. And then he goes and he does this national camp Buffalo try out. He has three good games in a spring in a spring showcase and this week he’s up in the Quebec league. He got drafted by Youngsttown in the USHL and he just signed a four for four with Providence and he’s the same player he was three months ago, but all of a sudden, you know, and and if I had told people in the middle of the year, right, Evan, come watch a Middle Sex League high school hockey game, I got a kid who’s a need should get a four for four in Hockey East. Yeah. Yeah. We’ll get back to you, coach. 100%. you know, and then like and then like two guys get hot on him or one guy gets hot on him and they’re all like, “Holy cow, everybody’s hot on him.” Like, yeah, you just got to get the like. So, so point they start asking you where you’ve been hiding this kid and you’re like, “I’ve been telling you about this kid for two years, right? We’ve been writing about this kid for two years now.” I will say, John, it’s funny though, like back like I not to not to go too far off the padrop path, but like with recruiting, it is funny to see how like, you know, you’ll be beating the the drums on a kid and all it takes is one college to be like, “We really like this kid for everybody.” It’s like they all need their own approval. Like colleges will be like, “Oh, you like him? Oh, I like him too now.” And it’s like once one hits, all the dominoes fall. You just need I tell my parents and and this is like a portrait thing. It’s like what’s really the perception of him? It’s not really what he is as a player. It’s like who’s got this perception and this confirmation bias behind a guy. Half the time that’s the battle if you’re not a super elite guy. And and and Evan, yeah. I mean to your point like people ask me like what makes an NHL player, right? I use the term more because my kids are trying to get to college hockey. What makes a division one college player? A division one coach who thinks a kid’s a division one college player. There isn’t this five tools thing. Yeah. Like I watch college hockey really close. I see some kids who stink who wouldn’t play at Arlington High and they’re playing division one college hockey. Like for real, like I see kids play who wouldn’t be able to mentally be on my power play and they’re running around playing division one college hockey because somebody thinks they’re a division one college hockey player. And so like Jody, your point go back to portrait. It really isn’t like all those tools that you pointed out. It’s like does the organization think the winds at his back and we can use this kid and he’s 21. Like it’s really strange, right? Yeah. And to the Bruins credit though, like I think they’re a traditional NHL organization where they really make those young guys force a guy out like it’s always been in hockey. Like basically take his job. They have to get to a point where it’s so undeniable that they’re pushing somebody out. Um and that’s staying healthy. That’s being productive. That’s like having the wind at your back like you’re talking about having an organization that believes in you. Like having all that stuff. Um, and for him, I feel like, you know, last year was him getting back on track. I I I do think they needed him that first year when he was so good in training camp. They needed him at the beginning of the year at center because they didn’t have enough centers. They needed him to come in and play. Yeah. He did a really good job, but I also don’t think that did any favors for him developmentally like in the last couple of years. It kind of set him back a little bit. Yep. Yeah, I felt like he got back on track last year when they put him down in Providence and just let him stay there for a while. You could see, and I went down and watched him play a few times. You could see all the confidence coming back. You could see the swagger with the puck and him constantly looking to make plays. You could see him getting some of that stuff out of his game that was going to, you know, at the NHL level or high pro level, he was going to get stripped or it was going to put his team in a bad situation. Like that, you know, him constantly pulling the the puck up high by the blue line. like there’s times to do that and there’s times not to do that and like circling back and kind of doing that Gretzky delay thing especially high traffic it’s it’s tough to do that. Um and he and you could see he was starting to like become more of the player that they want him to be and I I still feel like he’s young enough where like he’s going to get another shot like an extended shot probably because of an injury like you’re talking about that’s going to open it up for him and he and he’s going to get a look. Um I I wouldn’t pass on him. I can tell you that. I’d stick with the kid for a little bit because of the intangibles. Right. Yeah, you know, and the the clear talent, like the the the creativity, the mind, the the ability to make plays, like it’s all there for him. Um I I think if he plays with the right players, like I remember watching, I think it was last year, him and Lori and Posternneck were out there together on a threeon-ree in overtime and it was awesome to watch. so much skill. Like the other team, I forget who they were playing. They ended up scoring the game-winning goal like and I think maybe Potrey went off at the end for a change, but like he was part of the three of them. They couldn’t get the puck from them and you could see them you you could see they were going to win. You could see it coming because they just couldn’t the other team couldn’t get the puck from him in threeon-ree OT because it was so much skill and good puck possession and skating and everything and they were all in the same wavelength as what they were trying to do out there. When you see moments like that with Lorai and with Potra, that’s when you want to continue to give them more chances because you say there’s really something there, especially when you’re putting them with a guy like Poster Neck who really thinks the game at a high level, too. It’s an interesting point, Joe. Like is this is something like I always say the NHL is the dinosaur of creativity compared to the other professional sports. Yeah. You know, um like that’s an interesting point. Like do you take a guy like that and do you plug him down onto the fourth line even though he’s not ready but you have him in your lineup because you can’t dress an extra forward. Right. Like you got to only dress 12. Right. Right. But you have him there like for situational like like is he your overtime specialist? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean? They And again I’m just be like not that I’m a little strange but I had my goalie out with 11 minutes ago in hockey night in Boston the other day. So, you’ve seen me how strange the stuff strange stuff I like doing, right? Evan, you but like I don’t think enough guys in hockey think outside the box at all. Like, so that’s like, okay, so you plug him into the fourth line. He’s not getting the minutes you want, but is he, you know, is he getting better practicing with the big guys every day? And, you know, does is he there as a as a I don’t think it’s something guys have thought about like I don’t think the NHL guys have thought enough about shootout moves. I think it should be more synchronized. I think it should be like player one comes down and he’s synced with player two, I’m going to do this move or I’m going to take this shot and based on that I’m setting the goalie up even for the next guy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don’t think they do it. I just I just think there still I just think it’s the dinosaur sport of creativity, you know. I agree. I agree with you. And so that’s an interesting point. Thinking outside the box with some of that stuff. I totally agree with you. or like some teams have had guys in the lineup too that were more like shootout sort of specialists too if they wanted that extra point, you know, have guys that are really good in the shootout to to make sure they could try and get that versus like having somebody that’s a different style of player, but like there isn’t a lot of that. I I totally agree. There’s much more of that obviously in baseball. Um, all right, let’s let’s switch gears to the youth sports stuff. Uh, before we wrap up, John, I just want to get your thoughts and Evan, you too, because we’re in the summertime. We’re in the middle of it. I think what what the Militia Cup is going on this weekend. Um there’s been tournaments like every single weekend for for the younger players. Uh there’s summer leagues, there’s all kinds of stuff. What your your thoughts as a coach on all of that stuff on what’s a good rule of thumb for hockey parents that are excited about wanting their kids to continue to play in the summertime and the kids want to play, but also like doing it the right amount or not doing it at all based on long-term development, based on not burning them out, based on them being excited to get back on the ice in the fall, you know, like when they should, like all that stuff. Because, you know, growing up, all of us, I think, were much more like seasonal with all the sports than kids are now. You know, you would play the sport that was in season and then you would put the stuff down for the most part when it was out of season and then you would pick it up again. Where do you fall on this just having seen this over years and years now? You want to go first, Evan? You want Oh, you want me to go first? Yeah, go ahead, John. You So So, so you you you got some great points there, though. Like if the kid wants to do it, like let him do it, right? You know what I mean? You know, if the kid’s excited to do it and he wants to go play in the Lobster pot up in Portland, Maine, you know, July 20th, like that’s great. Let him do it. You know what I mean? Like so, so that’s one thing like Yeah. So, you know, but I think there were times that parents like kind of, “Hey, you want to play in the lobster pot, Jimmy? Uh, your friend Joe and Smitty are playing in it.” and then the next thing you know the kid feels like he’s ob obligated to play in the lobster pot, right? So, I just think that um I think that you don’t need to hit the switch. I think when when you get close to high school, maybe eighth grade, freshman year in high school, you got to make a decision like, hey, this is the sport I want to try to focus on. And I think that’s when you kind of got to do it. I can only tell you what I did with my two boys, their equipment. The day the ridiculous eight-month season ended, right, of the Valley League. Yes. Or the EHF season or whatever they were playing. When that eight-month season ended, that was it. Like Anthony never played, okay? He never played um a day of summer hockey until August 15th every year. And he’s doing okay. Yep. Right. He did not play until he got into high school. He was a good baseball player. We were lucky. Our team went to the uh Cal Ripken World Series twice. Yep. And that’s what we did. And then they picked it up. He would put his gear on starting next Monday at my hockey school. Although it’s just Tuesday, Wednesday next week, Joe, don’t forget. Yes. And that was it. And and all those Arlington kids were on that baseball team. And oh, by the way, all those kids that were winning the World Series are also the best team in high school hockey in 2020 who didn’t skate all summer. Yep. So, and I’m not saying that’s right. like, you know, listen, you got you got to you got to run your own path, but there’s something to be said about hanging out, chilling, um, playing other sports. And I there’s an improvement window when you’re hungry that I think something people don’t talk about enough. When you’re like, “Dad, I want to get out there. I want to get out there.” Like, you get out there enthused for the like three to four to five weeks. There’s an improvement that happens in that window. Yep. versus the kid who’s just mundane. It’s another tournament, it’s another game, it’s another tournament, it’s another game. You know what I mean? Yeah. So, so it’s a balance. And then like the other thing is I’ve always said is, you know, and and I pushed this on the Penguins program, Joe, is like for the money, if you just spent 1,600 bucks and you just spent two grand on playing in tournaments for your kid and you wanted to spend two grand and you had the money you wanted to spend, would you would better off getting him with the right guy um 15, 20 hours of private lessons? Yeah. In the summertime instead. Yeah. Right. Which which way does he get better? Because the high like Joe, you’ve seen it. The hockey when they’re not in hockey shape, right, is not very good. No. Some stinks. Well, and and it’s also like when you’re throwing kids together in these tournaments that have never played together before and never practiced together, none, never done anything together. And it’s just it it’s not good hockey that way either. You know what I mean? Like like uh it’s very different levels a lot of times. It’s very different kids that like are coming into the tournaments with like different ideas of what they want to do or what you know what’s in it for them. And we’re talking about fifth and sixth grade is you know young kids like that that even younger than that up to fifth, sixth, seventh grade. Totally. Like I agree with you. I think once you get to like eighth grade, once you get to like 14, 15 years old, that’s when you start doing this stuff a lot more intensely and you have like, okay, I’m gonna I want to play hockey in high school. like I’m going to like, you know, follow that a little bit more and just work geared towards that sport a little bit more. But I think the kids on the like what you’re seeing now, John, is like seven, eight year old kids that are playing on tournament teams that are playing and they and they’re, you know, they score one goal and it ends up on YouTube and it’s like slow-mo video looks good, but like they’re playing like every weekend in the summertime for these tournaments uh that are going on all over the place and like the kids want to do it for sure. I my question to you though is like what do you think would they would get more out of like Oh, it’s a no-brainer. Take take by the time you do your travel and everything. Let’s say it’s three grand. You give that three grand to Mr. V, Paul Vincent, who’s still the man. Yep. Right. Yeah. You you give your money to Paul Vincent and for you give him that three grand in September 1, your kid will be a million times better than if he had played these these tournaments, right? Yep. You know what I mean? Like Yeah. Just it’s just where the sport is. It’s crazy. Like look at I do small area games. I you know I think that I believe in them and stuff. Yep. But when I was a kid I did small area games too. You know we never did it on the ice. It was called street hockey. Yes. Okay. Now you have to make kids play. You know what I mean? Like Yeah. I mean I’m pretty pumped here in they they have their own like roller leagues and still at the high school level like they they’re out all the time with it. But you know, so like you know that’s if if you really if if if you’re a parent, let’s not kid ourselves. We all when our kid gets on the ice hope that this that day where all of a sudden he hits the ice and like he just got Lane Hudson’s disease. Right. Right. Right. Let’s let’s not kid ourselves. We’re all hoping for that. Oh yeah. And you know I if if you’re better off like sending your kid to Paul Vincent and like he’s just so good the way he does his stuff than doing the lobster pot and the um you know the Springfield grass mowing tournament and yeah the tropic meltdowns for every meltdown. Yep. Chowder. Uh, by the way, before we get to Evan, um, if anybody John is doing, uh, a camp, uh, in Wuburn in the next couple of weeks, uh, late afternoon, uh, Finn will be there for sure. Um, awesome. He’s been before. It’s a great way to gear up for the season. This is like the late August, mid to late August stuff that if you your kid does want to get ready for the season, it’s it’s a great skate. Uh you can go to ww.m missourik skatingkills skatingkills.com to check out more info about that. Uh but you’ll see me go to that you’ll see me there. You’ll see Mazoo there. You’ll see uh Finn out there skating around with the other kids. Uh it’s and he’s done it before. It’s an awesome practice. It’s a great skate. Um Evan, one of the things I do at this camp, okay, is I I used to do it uh this is like my 30th year doing it, right? Like I used to do it and it’s an offshoot of Mr. be just for two weeks, you know, at the end of the summer to get the kids going into the season. Like I don’t do it all year, right? So, yep. One of the things I do, Evan, though, that would be tricky with you is, and Joe’s seen this, I used to do an older group and a younger groups, right? And I’d have them split up, but I started to find out that if I have high school kids on the ice with eight-year-old kids, one, the eight-year-old kids aren’t killing each other in line and they’re in awe of the high school kids. and the wind at your back like we were talking about, right, is, you know, so they’re seeing the high school kids grind, so they’re grinding, right? So, I’d be happy to have you out there. I’m just a little bit worried about when the young kids are watching you take Happy Gilmore Dixies over blue lines over Dennis Weidman tripped over the blue line that he made famous when he was with the Bruins. He used to do that all the time. Yeah. Tripped over the blue line again. Yeah. Just worried about the effect on the young kids you’d have. Even though you’re the goat, baby. I do remember Evan in high school for that Framingham team, by the way. Do you really? Yeah. Yeah. Because I I went on report on him. Ah, he was steady. Stay at home. Yep. Needed a little bit soft. Yeah. You could beat him on battles in front of the net a little bit like Yeah. Yeah. A little bit because his Framingham team was playing right in front of my uh Arlington team. I mean, they were playing for the division one title when we were playing Central for the Super Eight title in the in the Garden that year. So, but no, I mean Joe, like on the development path, like it’s different for everybody and the kids like the kids have got to like the biggest thing as you get older is you got to be a gym rat. You got to be a gym rat and you gota and you got to be a shooting pucks rat. Yep. You know what I mean? Like if you want to improve like, you know, like I said, like it’s no differently than we just talked um it’s no different we just talked about, right? you know, like he can he can develop, right? He’s still young enough that he can develop like, you know, and um you know, that’s that’s that’s what he’s got to look at. So, um you know, and that’s what you got to look at with your kid is like, you know, do you go do you know, you got to go to Mike Boils, right? Yeah. You know, you got to do that to be a good player now. Like I tell my players like you can’t train on your own now because these trainers out there are very good at what they’re doing and you’ve got to go to these gyms and uh and again that’s more money and more money gearing it towards hockey, right? Yeah. Yeah. I mean Joe I have the video thing I got a few kids doing like I have um um you know I have a video thing that I do if kids want to do videos now like because there are a lot of other people doing it right and I get a lot of outreach like hey you’re only coaching in I want to get my kid you know with you right? So, you know, so there’s a lot of training tools out there that I just think your money could be spent more wisely on than going to play in some, you know, tournament in Nashville or whatever. That that’s my two cents because you’re playing enough of them. You do enough traveling and all that stuff during the season. Yep. I see what I’ve discovered um now at this point with with Finn is that like doing one or two of them a summer is more than enough. Like that’s all you need to do. like if they want to and he and Finn mostly wants to do it with his buddies now. So like you know you you figure out a way and maybe I’ll coach the team or whatever, but you figure out a way to have one or two tournaments where it’s him, a couple of his buddies, maybe some kids that he hasn’t played with before. Uh he did the Boston Showdown. He did it with a bunch of elite Junior Eagles kids and some of his friends. And it was great. It was exactly what he was looking for and what I was looking for. And that’s all you need. You do not need to do a tournament every single weekend for the entire summer. Like I think that is the way to burn out your kid by the time he’s 12 and have him just not want to play anymore, you know? Oh, you see the flip big time. Like I’ve seen the flip big time. Like in Anony’s group, it was unbelievable. The three best players like were done. Like they were committed back then. You could be committed when you were 14. Of the three kids in Anony’s 01 group who were committed at age 14. And when I tell you these three were dominant. Yep. Only one of them ended up playing college hockey. Yeah. At age 14. Yeah. They were committed. One was committed to the Northeast and one was committed to BC and one was committed to Harvard and only one of them ended up playing college hockey. I believe it. So, I think there’s so many changes that happen for every kid between like 14 to 18 years old that like can change everything. It’s a mental grind as far as interest. I love what Ryan Whitney said too. Like, uh, talk to me about these elite like 10-year-old kids when they have their first beer and have their first girlfriend. And if there’s Well, yeah. I I I do the girlfriend thing. I I have a saying for that. Like, you know, a a after they have their first go around with their girlfriend like on a date or whatever, are they going to like go out with her all the time or are they going to still shoot some pucks? You know what I mean? Like, totally. You know, so it changes everything. But listen, I think Ev I think we lost Evan. He sent me a text. Um, yep. I’m gonna Yeah, I know you need to get going. So, I’m going to let you go, Missou. Let me wrap this up. Welcome to the Pucks with uh thanks for listening to the Pucks with a podcast, a proud member of the CNS CLS media network. Make sure to hit subscribe to the Bruins Ringside YouTube channel and turn on notifications for when a new video drops on the channel. Show is also brought to you by Prize Pix, the largest daily fantasy sports platform in North America. Download the Prize Pix app today. Use the code CLS to get $50 instantly when you play five bucks. That’s code CLNS on Prize Pics to get $50 instantly when you play five bucks. You don’t even need to win to receive the $50 bonus. It’s guaranteed. Prize picks run your game. John Mori, thank you very much for joining us, my friend. have a great uh showcase this weekend. Thanks, Joe. Good stuff. Thanks for having me. And I’ll sign off for Evan. The goat. The goat has the goat has spoken and left the building. All right. Thanks for listening, everybody. We’ll see you at the ring. [Music]

Pucks with Haggs host Joe Haggerty, the NEHJ’s Evan Marinovsky and Arlington High hockey coach John Messuri talk about expectations for the Bruins, and answer some questions about summer hockey options for youth hockey players.

0:00 ⏰EPISODE TIMELINE⏰
1:17 Why John chose his outfit
2:08 John’s high school showcase
4:10 Thoughts on Bruins free agency moves
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24:19 Could Poitras beat out Mittelstadt for center spot on second line?
35:59 How much hockey should kids be playing in the summer?
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